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04-04-2009, 03:26 PM
Mike | Water Rudder
A few weeks ago Tom had asked me about my water rudder and this got me to thinking again.
It seems like the major concern is the lack of control to either side or more control on one side than the other.
As of today I have only been in the water twice and that was some time ago. I hope to get a lot of water time this year.
Two things come to mind. 1- The lack of rudder control & 2- The lack of a pivot point. In my days of sailing the rudder worked well if the center board or dagger board (located in the center of the boat) was down. It seems to me that the seawind should have some type of pivot point to make the rudder more effective. So....If the gear is down does the rudder work better? Should the rudder be linked to a hyd. cly. instead of the air rudder? Would the nose gear be helpfull in turning the plane? Of course this would come into play with slow taxi.....
07-21-2009, 07:05 PM
BudG | Water Rudder
just as a rudder on a boat ; you must have forward movement through the water or there is absolutely no load on the shaft to steer the hull.
as I recall Arnie Tanzman put the gear down and let the air rudder help steer.
The rudder on the Seawind is small at best and it will require higher speed
through the water to be effective . The small rudder will stall and act as a brake as it is rotated. I shortened my rudder which will aggravate the problem
but having run aground with a 37,000 lb boat a few times I' m a little gun shy about tearing the whole thing off if I hit a sand bar.
Putting the gear down may be a great idea.
08-23-2009, 11:45 PM
jgrimaud | Water Rudder
I had all kinds of problems with my rudder. Poor controllability, Water pressure on it causing it to partially raise so that I had to hold the rudder handle down to be able to use it, filling with water, you name it. I remade my rudder out of two pieces of aluminum riveted together, similar to my Lake Buccaneer but with the same profile as the fiberglass rudder, and solved all of my problems and have much better controllability. I used a ten ton press to shape the aluminum pieces around a steel rod of similar size as the rudder control rod, before rivetting the two pieces together. The water rudder is still far from being as effective as on my Buccaneer but then again, the rudder on the Buccaneer is far larger.
08-24-2009, 06:44 AM
Mike
Since my 1st post I have had the plane in the water several times. I have very good steering to the left and not so great to the right. Another thing to put on the list!
08-24-2009, 03:48 PM
Fred Lohr
I didnt have very good rudder control until i increased the size of the rudder. A long time seawinder suggested it and it did help. The negative is that it projects down a bit below the hull even in the retracted position (about 1 inch). The top of the rudder towards the front can be extended as well. The goal is to fill every milimeter of available space in the retracted position.For rotation, 40 degrees right and left is enough and you can get that by a larger wheel at the top of the post.
I filled mine with foam because it kept filling with water thru cracks. The larger rudder has worked very well.The forward lower edge has been used as a depth finder a few times and i will add some armour to that the next time i crack it.
This winter, i did seal that area as suggested by John riciotti and I no longer have the risk of water sneaking in thru the cable areas when parked on a beach and the tide comes in. I would have been easier to do before closing the lid during construction, but wasn't too bad.
I would be very interesting to see how Dick Silva changed this on the certified version ,so the rudder apparently projects out the back. Has Anyone seen this Yet?
Mike | Water Rudder
A few weeks ago Tom had asked me about my water rudder and this got me to thinking again.
It seems like the major concern is the lack of control to either side or more control on one side than the other.
As of today I have only been in the water twice and that was some time ago. I hope to get a lot of water time this year.
Two things come to mind. 1- The lack of rudder control & 2- The lack of a pivot point. In my days of sailing the rudder worked well if the center board or dagger board (located in the center of the boat) was down. It seems to me that the seawind should have some type of pivot point to make the rudder more effective. So....If the gear is down does the rudder work better? Should the rudder be linked to a hyd. cly. instead of the air rudder? Would the nose gear be helpfull in turning the plane? Of course this would come into play with slow taxi.....
07-21-2009, 07:05 PM
BudG | Water Rudder
just as a rudder on a boat ; you must have forward movement through the water or there is absolutely no load on the shaft to steer the hull.
as I recall Arnie Tanzman put the gear down and let the air rudder help steer.
The rudder on the Seawind is small at best and it will require higher speed
through the water to be effective . The small rudder will stall and act as a brake as it is rotated. I shortened my rudder which will aggravate the problem
but having run aground with a 37,000 lb boat a few times I' m a little gun shy about tearing the whole thing off if I hit a sand bar.
Putting the gear down may be a great idea.
08-23-2009, 11:45 PM
jgrimaud | Water Rudder
I had all kinds of problems with my rudder. Poor controllability, Water pressure on it causing it to partially raise so that I had to hold the rudder handle down to be able to use it, filling with water, you name it. I remade my rudder out of two pieces of aluminum riveted together, similar to my Lake Buccaneer but with the same profile as the fiberglass rudder, and solved all of my problems and have much better controllability. I used a ten ton press to shape the aluminum pieces around a steel rod of similar size as the rudder control rod, before rivetting the two pieces together. The water rudder is still far from being as effective as on my Buccaneer but then again, the rudder on the Buccaneer is far larger.
08-24-2009, 06:44 AM
Mike
Since my 1st post I have had the plane in the water several times. I have very good steering to the left and not so great to the right. Another thing to put on the list!
08-24-2009, 03:48 PM
Fred Lohr
I didnt have very good rudder control until i increased the size of the rudder. A long time seawinder suggested it and it did help. The negative is that it projects down a bit below the hull even in the retracted position (about 1 inch). The top of the rudder towards the front can be extended as well. The goal is to fill every milimeter of available space in the retracted position.For rotation, 40 degrees right and left is enough and you can get that by a larger wheel at the top of the post.
I filled mine with foam because it kept filling with water thru cracks. The larger rudder has worked very well.The forward lower edge has been used as a depth finder a few times and i will add some armour to that the next time i crack it.
This winter, i did seal that area as suggested by John riciotti and I no longer have the risk of water sneaking in thru the cable areas when parked on a beach and the tide comes in. I would have been easier to do before closing the lid during construction, but wasn't too bad.
I would be very interesting to see how Dick Silva changed this on the certified version ,so the rudder apparently projects out the back. Has Anyone seen this Yet?